The teircide was a disaster. The skiff walked away with a battleship level tank with nothing fitted, you can't alter the ore holds, the covetor has no slots let alone fitting room, the skiff mines close to what a hulk can pull which means flying anything other than a skiff is pointless. These ships are pre fitted, poorly balanced against eachother and offer near no options.

That.

*hint*

kill the rats first

I would propose that if rats are a problem you kill them with something else first then come back. The respawn timers on them are like an hour or some such.

No that just results in more imbalance. You don't fix an overpowered ship by buffing everything else to match it

Also, the rats need to be more numerous in HiSec. Don't send a couple of frigates, send a small Rat fleet: 3 Frigates, 2 Destroyers, 1 Cruiser. Make the miners fight at least NPC's. Mix it up, have a 3 Cruiser squadron visit. Make the fleets even larger if the players in the system leave the combat sites laying around. Make the miners deal with combat sites or face large ratting fleets.

Reddit has the sisi stats ...
... no, i refuse to link it. :P

They have battleship level tanks right out of the box and come close to matching the high yield ships. They are very out of whack.

They have battleship level tanks

No longer.

• Procurer / Skiff mining capabilities will remain unchanged
• Retrievers / Mackinaws will get a 25% boost (to +36.25% / +25% over Procurer / Skiff)
• Covetors / Hulks will get a 7.65% boost (to +45.33% / +41.18% over Procurer / Skiff).

(Presuming max-yield fit, since the Covetor and Hulk are getting 3rd low slots... so without any MLUs, the yield of those two will actually go *down* a bit)

Ok having messed around with them all:

Hulk and Mack can only work with a CPU mod but fitting one means the skiff is simply a better ship.

The covetor and retriever have no fitting options at all, the procurer is the only option.

At least one rig or one low needs a CPU mod/rig in it to actually fit it.

Its terrible. The fitting slots on the cov and ret are simply not there. On the hulk and mack you lose either yield or tank to actually use the slots given to you. Meanwhile the skiff isnt far behind in yield but is easily hitting 80K+ ehp plus gets harder hitting drones.

Its a no brainer, the skiff and proc are hands down better ships than the other barges.

Baltec1 has the right of it. The changes are really not good for the ships. It's basically killed off the value of the previous Two Slot barges. They should have just eliminated them and given all of us with them refunds of ISK value if they are going to do this.

There is a difference between making choices and getting a ship with one mid and three low slots to play with.



Don't lie.

I have clearly said several times in numerous threads that barges need more fitting slots, CPU and powergrid.

It doesn't need more "power". What EVE needs is ships and game mechanics that require common sense, understanding of the game mechanics involved and initiative. THAT is how you keep people playing this game.

The Procurer, Skiff and Orehold in general are a direct result of CCP giving up on expecting miners to fit their ships intelligently and instead giving them ships that have tank and cargo right out of the box. They removed the choice to fail because over the years it became apparent that miners are incapable of making the right decisions based on understanding and initiative. As such we need to move away from shoehorned "pre-fit" ships, remove the base stats back to normal, lower the ore holds and then add extra fitting slots for miners to make their own choices (just as with almost every other ship) to give miners a CHOICE to fit as they want.

That's how you "breed" capable players, this experiment with barges as is, orehold etc is yet another example of the handholding carebear style CCP had/has been advocating for so many years now. It's with so many aspects of this game atm and it has been an ongoing change over the years, even back in 2008 it was obvious what was going to happen and in my case I predicted Incarnage and the current situation we're in, simply because it's an obvious consequence of the choices CCP has been making. That is why we have these massive coalitions in 0.0, they're not fierce pvpers they are in fact carebears who are actually detrimental to the game.

The problem isn't EVE being too harsh, it's CCP having been busy trying to cater to a more mainstream type of customer who, for obvious reasons, can't hack it in this EVE environment. HTFU.